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* Products  
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  [AI-Powered Network Security Platform](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security?ts=markdown)
  
  * [AI Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/ai-security?ts=markdown)
  
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  * [Advanced URL Filtering](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/advanced-url-filtering?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Advanced WildFire](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/advanced-wildfire?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Advanced DNS Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/advanced-dns-security?ts=markdown)
  
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  * [Next-Gen Trust Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/next-gen-trust-security?ts=markdown)
  
  * [OT Device Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/ot-device-security?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Next-Generation Firewalls](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/next-generation-firewall?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Hardware Firewalls](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/hardware-firewall-innovations?ts=markdown)
  
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  * [PAN-OS](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/pan-os?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Panorama](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/panorama?ts=markdown)
  
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  * [Remote Browser Isolation](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/sase/remote-browser-isolation?ts=markdown)
  
  * [SaaS Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/sase/saas-security?ts=markdown)  
    [AI-Driven Security Operations Platform](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Cloud Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Cortex Cloud](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Application Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud/application-security?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Cloud Posture Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud/cloud-posture-security?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Cloud Runtime Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud/runtime-security?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Prisma Cloud](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/prisma/cloud?ts=markdown)
  
  * [AI-Driven SOC](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Cortex XSIAM](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cortex-xsiam?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Cortex XDR](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cortex-xdr?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Cortex AgentiX](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/agentix?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Cortex XSOAR](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cortex-xsoar?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Cortex Exposure Management](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/exposure-management?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Cortex Xpanse](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cortex-xpanse?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Cortex Advanced Email Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/advanced-email-security?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Unit 42 Managed Detection \& Response](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/managed-detection-and-response?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Unit 42 Managed XSIAM](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/managed-xsiam?ts=markdown)  
    [![](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/content/dam/pan/en_US/images/cyberark/Seamless_IDs_small.jpg)  
    Identity Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/identity-security?ts=markdown)

* Solutions  
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  Secure AI by Design
  
  * [Secure AI Ecosystem](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/prisma/prisma-ai-runtime-security?ts=markdown)
  * [Secure GenAI Usage](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/sase/ai-access-security?ts=markdown)  
    Network Security
  * [Cloud Network Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/software-firewalls?ts=markdown)
  * [Data Center Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/data-center?ts=markdown)
  * [DNS Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/advanced-dns-security?ts=markdown)
  * [Intrusion Detection and Prevention](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/advanced-threat-prevention?ts=markdown)
  * [Device Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/device-security?ts=markdown)
  * [OT Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/ot-security-solution?ts=markdown)
  * [5G Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/5g-security?ts=markdown)
  * [Secure All Apps, Users and Locations](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/sase/secure-users-data-apps-devices?ts=markdown)
  * [Secure Branch Transformation](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/sase/secure-branch-transformation?ts=markdown)
  * [Secure Work on Any Device](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/sase/secure-work-on-any-device?ts=markdown)
  * [VPN Replacement](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/sase/vpn-replacement-for-secure-remote-access?ts=markdown)
  * [Web \& Phishing Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/network-security/advanced-url-filtering?ts=markdown)  
    Cloud Security
  * [Application Security Posture Management (ASPM)](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud/application-security-posture-management?ts=markdown)
  * [Software Supply Chain Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud/software-supply-chain-security?ts=markdown)
  * [Code Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud/code-security?ts=markdown)
  * [Cloud Security Posture Management (CSPM)](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud/cloud-security-posture-management?ts=markdown)
  * [Cloud Infrastructure Entitlement Management (CIEM)](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud/cloud-infrastructure-entitlement-management?ts=markdown)
  * [Data Security Posture Management (DSPM)](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud/data-security-posture-management?ts=markdown)
  * [AI Security Posture Management (AI-SPM)](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud/ai-security-posture-management?ts=markdown)
  * [Cloud Detection and Response (CDR)](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud-detection-and-response?ts=markdown)
  * [Cloud Workload Protection (CWP)](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud/cloud-workload-protection?ts=markdown)
  * [Web Application \& API Security (WAAS)](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud/web-app-api-security?ts=markdown)  
    Security Operations
  * [Cloud Detection and Response (CDR)](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cloud-detection-and-response?ts=markdown)
  * [Security Information and Event Management](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/modernize-siem?ts=markdown)
  * [Network Security Automation](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/network-security-automation?ts=markdown)
  * [Incident Case Management](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/incident-case-management?ts=markdown)
  * [SOC Automation](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/security-operations-automation?ts=markdown)
  * [Threat Intel Management](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/threat-intel-management?ts=markdown)
  * [Managed Detection \& Response](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/managed-detection-and-response?ts=markdown)
  * [Attack Surface Management](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cortex-xpanse/attack-surface-management?ts=markdown)
  * [Compliance Management](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cortex-xpanse/compliance-management?ts=markdown)
  * [Internet Operations Management](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cortex-xpanse/internet-operations-management?ts=markdown)
  * [Extended Data Lake (XDL)](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cortex-xdl?ts=markdown)
  * [Agentic Assistant](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/cortex-agentic-assistant?ts=markdown)  
    Endpoint Security
  * [Endpoint Protection](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/endpoint-protection?ts=markdown)
  * [Extended Detection \& Response](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/detection-and-response?ts=markdown)
  * [Ransomware Protection](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/ransomware-protection?ts=markdown)
  * [Digital Forensics](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/digital-forensics?ts=markdown)  
    [Industries](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/industry?ts=markdown)
  * [Public Sector](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/industry/public-sector?ts=markdown)
  * [Financial Services](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/industry/financial-services?ts=markdown)
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  * [Small \& Medium Business Solutions](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/industry/small-medium-business-portfolio?ts=markdown)  
    [![](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/content/dam/pan/en_US/images/cyberark/Seamless_IDs_small.jpg)  
    Identity Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/identity-security?ts=markdown)

* Services  
  ![black arrow pointing left to go back to main navigation](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/etc/clientlibs/clean/imgs/arrow-right-black.svg) Services  
  [Threat Intel and Incident Response Services](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Assess](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/assess?ts=markdown)
  
  * [AI Security Assessment](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/assess/ai-security-assessment?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Attack Surface Assessment](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/assess/attack-surface-assessment?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Breach Readiness Review](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/assess/breach-readiness-review?ts=markdown)
  
  * [BEC Readiness Assessment](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/bec-readiness-assessment?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Cloud Security Assessment](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/assess/cloud-security-assessment?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Compromise Assessment](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/assess/compromise-assessment?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Cyber Risk Assessment](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/assess/cyber-risk-assessment?ts=markdown)
  
  * [M\&A Cyber Due Diligence](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/assess/mergers-acquisitions-cyber-due-diligence?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Penetration Testing](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/assess/penetration-testing?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Purple Team Exercises](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/assess/purple-teaming?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Ransomware Readiness Assessment](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/assess/ransomware-readiness-assessment?ts=markdown)
  
  * [SOC Assessment](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/assess/soc-assessment?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Supply Chain Risk Assessment](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/assess/supply-chain-risk-assessment?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Tabletop Exercises](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/assess/tabletop-exercise?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Unit 42 Retainer](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/retainer?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Respond](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/respond?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Cloud Incident Response](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/respond/cloud-incident-response?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Digital Forensics](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/respond/digital-forensics?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Incident Response](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/respond/incident-response?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Managed Detection and Response](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/respond/managed-detection-response?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Managed Threat Hunting](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/respond/managed-threat-hunting?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Managed XSIAM](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cortex/managed-xsiam?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Unit 42 Retainer](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/retainer?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Transform](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/transform?ts=markdown)
  
  * [IR Plan Development and Review](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/transform/incident-response-plan-development-review?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Security Program Design](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/transform/security-program-design?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Virtual CISO](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/transform/vciso?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Zero Trust Advisory](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/transform/zero-trust-advisory?ts=markdown)  
    [Global Customer Services](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/services?ts=markdown)
  
  * [Education \& Training](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/services/education?ts=markdown)
  
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    UNIT 42 RETAINER
    Custom-built to fit your organization's needs, you can choose to allocate your retainer hours to any of our offerings, including proactive cyber risk management services. Learn how you can put the world-class Unit 42 Incident Response team on speed dial.
    Learn more](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/unit42/retainer?ts=markdown)

* Partners  
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  NextWave Partners
  
  * [NextWave Partner Community](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/partners?ts=markdown)
  * [Cloud Service Providers](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/partners/nextwave-for-csp?ts=markdown)
  * [Global Systems Integrators](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/partners/nextwave-for-gsi?ts=markdown)
  * [Technology Partners](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/partners/technology-partners?ts=markdown)
  * [Service Providers](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/partners/service-providers?ts=markdown)
  * [Solution Providers](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/partners/nextwave-solution-providers?ts=markdown)
  * [Managed Security Service Providers](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/partners/managed-security-service-providers?ts=markdown)  
    Take Action
  * [Portal Login](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/partners/nextwave-partner-portal?ts=markdown)
  * [Managed Services Program](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/partners/managed-security-services-provider-program?ts=markdown)
  * [Become a Partner](https://paloaltonetworks.my.site.com/NextWavePartnerProgram/s/partnerregistration?type=becomepartner)
  * [Request Access](https://paloaltonetworks.my.site.com/NextWavePartnerProgram/s/partnerregistration?type=requestaccess)
  * [Find a Partner](https://paloaltonetworks.my.site.com/NextWavePartnerProgram/s/partnerlocator)  
    [CYBERFORCE
    CYBERFORCE represents the top 1% of partner engineers trusted for their security expertise.
    Learn more](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cyberforce?ts=markdown)

* Company  
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  Palo Alto Networks
  
  * [About Us](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/about-us?ts=markdown)
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  * [Corporate Responsibility](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/about-us/corporate-responsibility?ts=markdown)
  * [Military \& Veterans](https://jobs.paloaltonetworks.com/military)  
    [Why Palo Alto Networks?](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/why-paloaltonetworks?ts=markdown)
  * [Precision AI Security](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/precision-ai-security?ts=markdown)
  * [Our Platform Approach](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/why-paloaltonetworks/platformization?ts=markdown)
  * [Accelerate Your Cybersecurity Transformation](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/why-paloaltonetworks/nam-cxo-portfolio?ts=markdown)
  * [Awards \& Recognition](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/about-us/awards?ts=markdown)
  * [Customer Stories](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/customers?ts=markdown)
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    Careers
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* More  
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  * [Packet Pushers Podcasts](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/podcasts/packet-pusher?ts=markdown)  
    Connect
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# How Nations Hack, Spy, and Win

Apr 16, 2026  
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Threat Vector | How Nations Hack, Spy, and Win  
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15s 30s  
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*00:00* *00:00*

*** ** * ** ***

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**Most people think nation-state cyberattacks are unpredictable. Allie Mellen wrote the book that proves they're not.**

[++Allie Mellen++](https://www.linkedin.com/in/hackerxbella/) is the author of *Code War: How Nations Hack, Spy, and Shape the Digital Battlefield* and a leading industry analyst and former hacker. She advises Global 2000 organizations on detecting and responding to nation-state attacks. Her research career began as a hacker with work featured at Black Hat USA. She has partnered with multiple government agencies on election security and regularly briefs the Wall Street Journal, NPR, and the Washington Post.

Allie joined Threat Vector previously to break down the XDR landscape and what's next for security operations. This time, the conversation goes somewhere different.

In this conversation with [++David Moulton++](https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidrmoulton/), Allie breaks down the strategic logic behind attacks most defenders treat as random events.

**You'll learn:**

* Why nation-state attacks follow predictable strategic patterns, not chaos

* How military doctrine and national history shape a country's hacking behavior

* What makes Stuxnet, WannaCry, NotPetya and the Sony Pictures hack so instructive

* How to tell the difference between espionage, disruption and destruction campaigns

* What defenders and executives can actually do with this knowledge

Allie has spent years studying threat actors from China, Russia, Iran, North Korea, Israel and the United States. Her analytical framework connects the dots between geopolitical objectives and the technical tradecraft security teams see on the wire every day.

This episode is essential listening if you're a CISO translating threat intelligence into board-level strategy, a threat analyst trying to understand adversary intent, or a security leader who wants to think about the geopolitical forces shaping your threat landscape.

**Related Episodes:**

* [++Inside the Mind of State-Sponsored Cyberattackers++](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/resources/podcasts/threat-vector-inside-the-mind-of-state-sponsored-cyberattackers)

* [++Confronting China's Expanding Cyber Threats++](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/resources/podcasts/threat-vector-confronting-chinas-expanding-cyber-threats)

* [++Lessons from the Underground++](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/resources/podcasts/threat-vector-lessons-from-the-underground)

* [++A Hacker's Insights on Your Privacy++](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/resources/podcasts/threat-vector-a-hackers-insights-on-your-privacy)

* [++Decoding XDR: Allie Mellen on What's Next++](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/resources/podcasts/threat-vector-decoding-xdr-allie-mellen-on-whats-next)

**Mentioned in the Show:**

**Anthropic --- "Disrupting the first reported AI-orchestrated cyber espionage campaign"** [++https://assets.anthropic.com/m/ec212e6566a0d47/original/Disrupting-the-first-reported-AI-orchestrated-cyber-espionage-campaign.pdf++](https://assets.anthropic.com/m/ec212e6566a0d47/original/Disrupting-the-first-reported-AI-orchestrated-cyber-espionage-campaign.pdf) Published November 2025. Anthropic's Threat Intelligence team report on threat actor GTG-1002, a Chinese state-sponsored group that used Claude Code to execute 80-90% of a cyber espionage campaign autonomously --- reconnaissance, exploitation, lateral movement, credential harvesting, and exfiltration --- across roughly 30 global targets.

**Allie Mellen --- Code War: How Nations Hack, Spy, and Shape the Digital Battlefield** Read Allie's book, Code War, now: [++https://bit.ly/m/codewar++](https://bit.ly/m/codewar)

\#NationStateCyber #ThreatIntelligence

**About Threat Vector**

Threat Vector by Palo Alto Networks is your premier podcast for security thought leadership. Join us as we explore pressing cybersecurity threats, robust protection strategies, and the latest industry trends.

The podcast features in-depth discussions with industry leaders, Palo Alto Networks experts, and customers, providing crucial insights for security decision-makers.

Whether you're looking to stay ahead of the curve with innovative solutions or understand the evolving cybersecurity landscape, Threat Vector equips you with the knowledge needed to safeguard your organization.

**Palo Alto Networks**

Palo Alto Networks enables your team to prevent successful cyberattacks with an automated approach that delivers consistent security across the cloud, network, and mobile.[⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ++⁠http://paloaltonetworks.com.++⁠⁠](http://paloaltonetworks.com/)

*** ** * ** ***

*Protect yourself from the evolving threat landscape -- [more episodes of Threat Vector are a click away](https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/podcasts/threat-vector)*  
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